Across the Universe (2007) dir. Julie Taymor | Showgays: A Movie Musical Podcast

0:00 [Music] [Applause] [Music] no no no no no no no no no no I Wanna Hold Your Hand I Wanna Hold Your Hand or as I felt about this movie I want to turn this off I wanna turn this off the work the my favorite part about

0:45 walking we did not talk this episode was that it was like I was highly I was highly considering being like hey Molly can we actually record on Wednesday so we can watch on Tuesday because it was already 9 30 when we chose 9 30 when we started yes Adam still had to do a podcast episode um there was a lot going on and so I'm moving it's a lot there's a lot happening we're not moving for two months but we were we were fresh off uh we were looking at apartments so we're like I'm frazzled but then Adam was like no I think it'll be fine because it's like you'll write your notes and then I don't think this movie will like obviously like you can like have it on you don't have to like fully focus on it and uh I don't know it was just so funny watching Adam watch this movie it ended up being like me watching him experience

1:32 the movie and that was true that was the truth these are really these are all the wrong conditions in which to watch this movie what you're describing to me yeah don't watch F like I would say after 8 30 maybe eight it's hard to turn on a movie that you should like pay attention I here's the thing that's all I'm gonna say to start with and I just like this is just not a movie for me and that's okay and there are plenty of movies in the world that are for lots of different people and I'm just one of the people that this movie is on multiple levels not for it's not even like one specific thing it's just like if there was a movie that they were like what is a movie that Adam would never enjoy it's this one that's fine I think they're like weird things I can't even I was gonna say it's not a

2:19 bad movie but it's like but they're like definitely choices or whatever happening which is whatever they're just all choices that I don't enjoy aesthetically we need to talk opening banter so you have to like tell me about your apartment search or something so oh that didn't help too it was the same day where Adam was like I have been using the wrong number to budget for looking for apartments we actually could be looking for apartments it doesn't matter seven or more basically yeah it's important for the story to know if you've been looking at two apartments or two chief of experiments yeah yeah so he was like oh we could have been get yeah we could have been looking at better our apartment search is going well um and by well we've not found anything yet we've gone on four tours but we're

3:04 still many many weeks away but when this episode comes out and we will have moved we would have moved I think no the heels we're about to we're about to move we're about to move when is this coming out this is the middle of September yeah well both have moved when this comes out where are you moving Calcutta Calcutta first no I'm moving to San Diego I might not be there yet if this is okay I'm so sorry dads I didn't ask your permission are your parents moving out there too no at some point your brother sister your sister brother

3:51 my brothers and his family live there yeah well I do love San Diego you're gonna work in La Jolla oh my God congratulations oh my mom more like La Moya matinee uh working at oh that was a very clever pun yeah yeah that worked really well lamoya is great figure out our filming schedule with a two-hour time difference oh yeah oh well and then you know a year after we moved to Seoul we'll have to figure that out too but you know yeah yeah we have to get visas for our podcast it's gonna be a lot of yeah yeah

4:36 international waters um also a great podcast international waters has anyone heard of NPR have we all heard of this have we heard a little one called All Things Considered they consider all things I I just saw this podcast called cereal it's really good have you heard uh 2016 what a Time very much part of that podcasts were invested before 2016. yeah I think it's 2014. I listened to cereal when I still lived in Chicago oh my God you're right because cereal I in the first episode of

5:22 our Disney podcast I do a Serial video and that we started in 2015 so yeah wow this week I have the arduous steps summarizing a lot of Across the Universe RJ can you time me absolutely Adam this is your one minute summary of the movie Across the Universe and your time starts now across the universe is about Jude a young man from Liverpool who goes to New Jersey to meet his father for the first time upon arriving he becomes friends with Max a college student who is more interested in having a good time than being a good student his sister is Lucy and when you meets her there is an immediate attraction Max

6:08 and Jude moved to New York City and joined the hippie lifestyle as it is late 60s they become friends with many including Sadie a rock singer JoJo guitarist and Prudence lesbian Lucy comes to visit and is moved by the anti-war sentiment coming from Paco another character in the film she and Jude followed love while Max is drafted to Vietnam Lucy becomes involved in the anti-war movement while Jude doesn't know and while Jude doesn't know what he wants to do and just simply pays Max is traumatized when the war and comes back Lucy and Jude break up but then kind of get back together in the in the end when everybody sings All You Need Is Love wow that was a minute you like so purposefully really slowed down as well to start this summary I knew you were confident in the amount that you had written because you were like we begin

6:54 in it was a very RJ summary honestly except with confidence throughout RJ yeah um the only things I would say I like left out is Sadie and JoJo's plot yeah Prudence entirely basically from the movie from the movie and uh that's it plot wise like there yeah you kind of strung through the at least the main yeah really the only thing about Sadie and JoJo to know is that Sadie gets famous they try to get her to leave JoJo behind and she does it first and then eventually they get back together and imply we're gonna go be a band together uh Molly what uh what is your

7:40 relationship to Across the Universe I I think so yeah absolutely I watched it with a big group of friends I liked it I continued to like it I know no just in my friends uh attic those Sarah Sarah's attic was a cool place to hang out yes it was at it yes there's attic um yeah I watched with a bunch of friends and I have a I have a memory of my friend um who was out as a lesbian at the time um giving like a look to another friend with some I Want to Hold Your Hands song that I think at the at the time I was like I feel like this must be like on the internet like she knew this was coming you know what I mean

8:28 oh my God um so that's a really cute memory that I have of it was it like it was an event like if everyone like paid attention to it or you you caught her doing it or was it like a oh everyone or when you say was your friend [Laughter] my very good friend I mean I mean did this friend tell me she had a crush on me somewhere close I don't remember before or after this um yes uh I don't think it was a big event but I also don't know that it was like I was the only person no you know what I mean I think it was like somewhere between those two okay yeah because I could also picture that like she does it and you're like am I seeing this and then you hold

9:14 the secret of link it was something I knew or was it well known it's not it wasn't like I was the only person that knew that she was gay and then like I was noticing like everyone in the room kind of knew this fact and then I just remember that being a little moment that happened around it yeah wow that is so crazy I mean like I what I was growing up and like my group of friends that were boys and we were oh all of us came out also this game but I I never felt like we all we had that I mean well I guess we had one straight friend in our group that like many of us had one we all have to avoid because he was just like the fact that a straight boy is like friendly to gays it's like oh the perfect man does exist

10:00 this I mean we're gonna be way off topic but Adam will be really happy about this I've had this conversation before that maybe I even said this on the Pod I think it's really interesting that like gay men have a thing for straight men and I feel like gay women really like gay women yeah yeah yeah not that there's like no jokes about like oh liking Straight girls I feel like it's very much not the kind of thing it is in the gay community of like yeah yes unfortunately I think yeah it's sadder because the root is more like we have been told that this is the ideal what a man is so it's like yeah you Pine over what that is because it's like I'm not inherently that so I and I guess it is culture like pulling us towards masculinity all the time do you know

10:45 what I mean of like well yeah masculine is ideal for like like just like attractive right and I don't want to say that like women have to masculine to be gay obviously not but like um there's I think that there's like less stigma to liking a masculine girl than there is maybe to liking a feminine boy so say that Molly uh that would be my dissertation I would write a very uh yeah a dissertation on why give sissies a chance would be my my social movement I'm not sure that we're inventing that concept but yeah I definitely have your I will Champion for him yeah yeah RJ so I just remember like seeing the title of this movie like all the time at

11:33 like Blockbuster because in Phoenix like Blockbusters stuck around until like throughout my high school career until two weeks ago I think yeah like we we for my mom and I frequented the Blockbuster uh and I just always felt like this was a movie that I saw but I never knew that it was a musical I just knew the the song the title was a song by The Beatles my parents also weren't that big of Beatles fans like they were more like the Disco Motown group so like I never really knew about Beatles songs I just picked it up from pop culture and RJ's favorite American Idol when they would do Beatles night and they would have to sing songs from like either Beatles night or like the the Paul McCartney uh songbook so

12:18 um that's kind of how I knew some of the songs I didn't really know all of the songs when we were watching this movie so that's pretty much it and I didn't I didn't connect the dots that it was Julie taymor until like lay way way later um and then fun fact for the ampliverse book club we read song of Spider-Man which is the uh written Memoir of Glenn Berger who wrote this the book for Spider-Man turn off the dark famously directed and conceived by Julie taymor so a lot of that actually that storyline the movie was like about to uh be released when Spider-Man was starting to like form and take shape so he would write about like the pressures that she was feeling about releasing the movie

13:04 and uh you know not getting great reviews being kind of like all at the same time like being also being criticized by this like crazy monster of the musical that's about to come out on Broadway so I kind of had that cloud my not cloud my judgment but I had that on top of mind when I was watching this because I was like okay I know that like this was Julie at her like you know post Lion King I am I am just so strongly of like my vision and everything and uh of clear uh clear uh specific idea I'm guessing we'll talk more about Spider-Man later but can you just give us the headline of like how does she come across in that memoir can you actually before that can you just for our mothers who have no idea who Julie said was can you tell people

13:50 is the director of Lion King on Broadway that's like her big uh her biggest her biggest thing um previously she like directed Frida which uh garnered with like critical attention for uh Salma Hayek which is why she's in the movie it was a cameo um so yeah but she just has that very strong visual um yeah like Vision which is big like puppets puppetry like giant mask work like very yeah visually kind of like almost reaching back into like how ancient theater operated but like making it contemporary was like I think her main focus yeah which is super it doesn't work in everything evidence for this bill but um it's like a cool it's a cool specific idea

14:36 um that excites a lot of people for sure and she is she's very big in the American Theater scene yes theater people she's like a choreographer I think technically by trade so she's it also is incorporated a lot of movements yeah uh in her visual style yeah but yeah like um uh Inspire in in the in the book he like writes him her very with a conflicted feeling obviously because like at one point very understanding of like this is teamwork should have directed cats listen say that he's been so good say that it would have been a mess but it would have been so bad I have some thoughts about that but no finish the Spiderman thing um that she like he he was basically saying like yes we all like there were times where we felt like this is too much but uh the main Crux of the book is

15:22 really like if the if if Julie was given everything that she could have been given um in her like original thought of what the move the musical could be it could have worked but there were just so many things that went like the main executive producer died um like stuff like just stuff things kept happening that like her original Dream kept so she's not fully sympathetic but it's a conflicted portrayal she doesn't have the villain of the book yes okay yeah but also like he's very very uh honest about like you know it's kind of like almost like verbally assaulty like she'll lash out on people if they don't get it uh or like does what she wants she's like yeah but then yeah it's just like going on yeah what's also interesting about that is that RJ's never read a headline before because that would be an

16:07 excruciatingly long headline yeah yeah I was trying to I was more yes I'm just pointing out for positive feedback here or did not positive constructive constructive because we're seeing the pattern with the summaries I'm just saying that I think we should examine where does this need to be an example and where does the need to not be I honestly just need to like start pre-preparing all my thoughts could you submit everything you're gonna say to me if only there was like a Google doc where you could write your notes yeah I do try to write my notes but like like in Cabaret I was like oh yeah he could get it that was the extent of my nose so it's high loads you know it's giving a

16:54 variety it's medium low medium low tepid Adam what is your relationship to the movie Across the Universe so I have never seen this film until last night um I this is 2007 is the same year that like Hairspray and Enchanted came out so we're definitely in the like post Chicago oh post Chicago boom yeah I think people have said that before yeah um but I remember this movie coming out and I just didn't want to see it I had no desire to see it it doesn't look like a movie for me the trailers were trippy because they included the like I am a walrus segment so definitely there was like you've got to be in a Vibe like that energy and you try to see this movie um I I don't really know the Beatles that

17:41 well I know like their major songs but that's pretty much it and like a cursory knowledge yeah what's up okay you're not muted so it's like I'm hearing you like moving your microphone I'm sorry thank you um I only have a cursory knowledge of The Beatles so I like know their major stuff but that's pretty much it I don't really like stories about Vietnam um and I don't I it's a personal preference you know something interesting or like whatever people's feelings yeah it's like not you know some people don't like sour cream and they're baked potatoes some people don't like Vietnam I think I am not trying to say anything about like obviously veterans or people who lived through the anti-war movement at the time or like anything about that I just think that our families were creating a lot of content there was a

18:28 dearth of content that was specifically regurgitating sentimentary Vietnam War like over and over in different forms but it was all it's always the same takeaway which is like we were in a bad War we shouldn't have been in the war and like obviously the soldiers did what they did but like we shouldn't necessarily hold it against them it was like the system was corrupt blah blah blah and like the the conversation about Vietnam has truly never progressed past that and it doesn't need to because it's all that's that's the Crux of the Vietnam War we shouldn't have been there um but like this movie doesn't get any deeper than that so I was like I just it was fine it was fine it was fine it's just not for me I think you're saying and I share the sentiment of like you have like Vietnam the

19:15 I think that that's really fair yeah I wouldn't just phrase it as like I don't like having babies things but like yes I have I have a shared fatigue of like this portrayal of this time and like weren't we all so heroic for doing all these protests it's like I feel that we've acknowledged you all enough yeah yeah um we all watch Forrest Gump so you know great job Robert zemeckis I think we really close the nail on the coffin with that I think also this is gonna be a weird pod and we will have listeners who will be yelling into their um headphones like Rita told us that she always does because none of us are gonna be like the Beatles fan representative yeah because I also I mean I don't dislike the Beatles but like similarly to both of

20:01 you like I know some songs from cultural osmosis but I don't have any particular relationship or feeling about them honestly and so I think we're all coming from like a similar place of like yeah sure the Beatles they're fine they're famous so we know them but we like don't have any real thoughts about it yeah if I had to like pick one I maybe would say Blackbird just because I feel like that's good that's the that's the one that I've heard covers of like female singers that I've really enjoyed it's an acoustic Bop yes yeah I think it's like simple to play so I think a lot of people yes for that reason yeah but listen The Beatles discography is great like no one's taking away that they knew how to write a song um we are at a we are at a point in in

20:46 the Beatles Legacy where like originally it was like predominantly women that liked the Beatles and then like and men were like they're just wow we're at a point where there's like Beetle beetles Bros who are like the Beatles are the greatest music that's ever existed so we've like fully won aided yeah because once again women are always on the Forefront of like pop culture and it takes the time for everybody to catch up anyway wow Adam has really ever since uh his uh lack of feminist Theory honestly the second wave thing is the only thing that's not in this movie a bra is not burned in this film which is very surprising it's not covered at all in the 60s betrayal yeah [Music]

21:33 foreign speaking of The Beatles so here here so with Mamma Mia I was like I'm gonna do Mamma Mia I'm gonna do that say what's going on let's give agnisa her flowers because who knows the names of the main okay everyone knows who's in The Beatles so I'm literally going to now read the first paragraph of the Wikipedia page and that is all I'm going to cover about the Beatles Because they're so ubiquitous that everyone knows the rest so here we go The Beatles were an English rock band formed in Liverpool in 1960 that comprised John Lennon Paul McCartney George Harrison and Ringo Starr they are regarded as the most influential band of

22:19 all time and were integral to the development of 1960s counterculture and popular music's recognition as an art form rooted in skiffle beat and 1950s rock and roll their sound Incorporated elements of classical music and traditional pop in innovative ways the band later explored Musical music Styles ranging from ballads and Indian music to psychedelia and hard rock as Pioneers in recording songwriting and artistic presentation The Beatles revolutionized many aspects of the music industry and were often publicized as leaders of the era's youth and social cultural movements now for the listeners I was a beautifully written paragraph by the way would like to call out for the listeners that the word revolutionized and publicized were with s's so that yeah I think they're written the British way so

23:04 so there Google said they are incorrectly spelled because Google said America baby I really like that your thought process was everyone knows who the Beatles are so I will read you the most overview thing I possibly could which I know won't contribute to your knowledge great and then blanket and just so you at the top of them just to remember refresh in case everyone was like the beat is that the one yeah she loves you yeah yeah I would say the first time I like connected with like Oh The Beatles were a thing was a joke from The Nanny because that was like some uh Mr Sheffield and Fran like for an episode just say like quoted Beatles lyrics to each other and I was like oh oh so like it's like a thing in the 60s like I wish that I had any shared cultural

23:51 references with art never seen the nanny you're awesome he's a Broadway producer that's like the main they know that because RJ told me about it on this podcast oh well when when we take our show gaze break we'll do a do we have an adding past where Molly and I re-watch do we have any thoughts about the history of The Beatles since we're on the topic before I move on to the film I mean there's also more pop culture references the Powerpuff Girls The Beatles episode called the beat alls and Mojo Jojo was swayed by like a another jar jar jar jar

24:37 jar was swayed by a like a a different monkey uh that was like Yoko Ono type uh oh see yeah and then um I think Family Guy did it's something that's constantly has been unfairly maligned she was an artist in her own right and shouldn't just be known as the woman who broke up the Beatles yeah um also though I think what's interesting about the Beatles is that Tamar is also known for doing a lot of Shakespeare um adaptations on film and I think it's interesting how the Beatles to me have a similar place in our culture at this point of just like ubiquitously referenced foundational type of stuff um like there was that movie that came out recently where it was like the guy yes like yeah yeah everyone else had

25:23 Amnesia yeah and they didn't know about the Beatles so he writes all their songs or whatever and you can just like reference that and you don't you don't need to like explain what that is right yeah and so I think it's interesting that taymor does this sort of like pulling from the most well-known the most I assume everybody knows and likes this thing and it was interesting because I read an interview with her that was done in 28 18 I think or maybe it was 2017 because it was the 10-year anniversary and they were doing like a re-release and so they were interviewing her to be like how do you feel about this movie 10 years later and during the Trump era and that kind of thing and she said something about the like oh you know sort of like Shakespeare is relevant all the time which I don't love as an attitude because it's a very white

26:09 colonialist mentality to be like Shakespeare's Universal to literally every single cultural and experience um but I do think that it's it's interesting the way that she has been able to rethink text like that and rethink other very commercially successful things because her her big thing she's known for is The Lion King and she managed to take this Disney movie that everybody knows and like present it an entirely different way where then it became really respected as like genuine art not that The Lion King from Disney is not art but it's a different kind of art right and so also derived from Shakespeare oh just a

26:54 through her career yeah yeah because even in her development of Spider-Man turn of the dark they they took the angle of uh like Arachne as like the Greek goddess to take spider form and she's the big villain so yeah she just she she loves to sink her teeth into it Adam was also fully boring himself I swear I thought he was gonna be like oh shoot I forgot to like uh turn off the stove or whatever but he was rushing over to the bar cart behind you in order to pour the wine and it was a perfectly framed shot of RJ giving me his real opinions about things and just in the distance Rita Rita would really appreciate your

27:41 broadcast we got them a bar cart for Christmas yeah it took him a while to pick it out and then it also took a long time to arrive because of um supply chain so I think it was like last week or something we got the Barker that we got for them as a gift like two years ago for Christmas oh yeah [Laughter] um so Across the Universe uh uh Jackson by Julie taymore as we have said at least 48 times at this point in this podcast screenplay is by dick Clement and Ian lafrene the story is by the three of them it is produced by Matthew gross Jennifer Todd and Suzanne Todd it stars Evan

28:26 Rachel Wood as the uh uh titular Lucy of Lucy in the Sky with Diamonds uh it stars Jim Sturgis as Jude in the titular Hey Jude and it starts they're not titular of the song the song title eponymous when it's something that's named that's what that's what I I know that that's the correct term I just didn't I was worried that I was gonna pronounce eponymous wrong so I got nervous that's one potential there because I know how to pronounce that one eponymous eponymous um and then uh Joe Anderson plays Max from another song yeah is Max a name in the song yes I don't know the song it was it's on

29:13 I don't know I don't know the beetle the three character which song their name comes okay uh cinematographies by Bruno Del benell I'd like to shout him out because there is some cool camera work happening uh cinematography yeah edited by Francoise Bono uh it is the music is by Elliot goldenthal the production and I guess also John Lennon and Paul McCartney yeah also Ellie Ellie is Julie Taylor's partner oh what does he do is it like uh like that one editor that also always works with Martin Scorsese like to see through all her scoring for her films maybe I don't know but they've been together since 1982 according to Wikipedia yeah Production Company Columbia

29:59 Pictures Revolution Studios gross entertainment team Todd distributed by Sony Pictures releasing um it was released uh first it was did the festival circuit so it did the Toronto International Film Festival first and then it went wide October 12 2007 which is also John Lennon's birthday it's running time is 133 very long minutes uh its budget is seven was 70.8 million dollars and it only made 29.6 so officially um I only have a few things because the if you if you love The Beatles If you said oh I know every little moment of

30:44 The Beatles I know I know I was I lived through it and I I was one of the girls I was one of the girls I love trivia yeah what you want to do is you want to go to imdb.com you want to search for Across the Universe you want to scroll down so you find the trivia section you want to click on that and then the entire trivia page is just every single visual reference name check song like background vocal just any how they stack the vocals of the songs like anything you'd live you'd live I read it and I was annoyed so we're different people Adam read it and went Aliyah I don't live you got me gal you got me girl well

31:29 so here's some interesting facts I found throughout all of the things that I read today Jake Gyllenhaal was originally to play the main character Jude um yeah the joint in the scene where they're like smoking I get like I wish I get high my friends with a little bit With a Little Help from My Friends uh it makes sense that they oh sorry no finish the thought yeah because the audience can't read the Google Docs again the joint in the shot me RJ and I were like where is there is there a tiny small that it's like no the joint is non-existent so that they didn't get in but they still blow out smoke yeah the joke I was gonna make that now makes sense is it makes sense that they edited

32:15 that out because without that joint there's not really any drug references to this movie so right yeah it was exactly the only thing yeah yeah yeah also like Evan racel's would Evan Rachel even Rachel's wood Evan Rachel's average are like on display in the film which is fine but I also think she was 18 when she shot this so it's just like we're we're just at like we're at a point in time we're at a point in time wow um it is a female director so I do feel a little bit better about that I guess but like we're just at a very we're just at a point in time um JoJo the character JoJo is supposed to be Jimmy Hendrix and pretty obviously lady is Janice Joplin which when she when the first scene happened and you

33:02 hear she's singing Helter Skelter but it's like the visuals of uh Lucy being arrested I was like that sounds exactly like Janice Joplin who was singing is that about Rachel Wood so when Sadie appeared I was like okay I got it got it and if I knew who Janice Joplin or Jimi Hendrix was that would be interesting to me wait you're joking I know what the names are can I name a single song No to be to be I said Janice Joplin and Adam was like who's that sense of who they are in like they were like rock people Counter Culture it's giving the late 60s early 70s it's giving they never did a Jimi Hendrix uh in Glee so I'm guessing that's true and they never sing they never sang somebody they probably did at some point down the line I just stopped watching it though I

33:47 just feel like I have I always feel like I like have pop culture blinders and I miss a lot of things and the idea that you would be like it's not immediately clear to me that these people are Jimi Hendrix and Jan Chaplin is so wild no Janice Joplin I have a very specific like eight-year span where I know nothing about pop culture which is very funny because it's the exact same eight year span that like my mother became like went from adolescent to adult so you'd think it's like the media that she would be like hey this is what I had but also my mom was not of The Counter Culture movement so she doesn't like very straightly she doesn't feel that like kinship with counterculture stuff in the same way that like some people some Boomers do so yeah I just didn't get shown it I shown a lot of 80s stuff I didn't get shot I mean and I got a lot

34:34 of early super Counter Culture but I just like know who Janice Joplin is because I've been alive in the world it's just so wild to me I know she is yeah I can't name a song I Can't name a song but I know her voice and her like overall presence yeah she's giving um what's her name before what's her name yeah good one she's giving Janice Joplin is what she's getting Spanish what's her name give me a song give me what um hat giving witch you guys [Laughter] I will say Janice Joplin I had a crash

35:22 course another popcorn sir I thought you were about to see what a crush on James and I was like no I got a crash course on like basically the standards of like American rock because of America no because of a show called Rockstar in excess where the band INXS was looking for their new lead singer because he died [Laughter] it was American Idol style people were voting but it was for the new so all the songs that they sang were like America like rock standards so I learned Janice Joplin I learned all the girls you know

36:08 through that because they had men and who is can I ask a real question Twyla Tharp is a is is a choreographer right yes and she did the Billy Joel musical moving out and she was in hair she was a dancer in the movie hair for some reason I think I think because there's this going there's there's some like Twila Tharp TT Janice Joplin JJ for some reason that gets really stuck in my mind they're not the same they're not but and isn't toilets are like a contemporary person yeah she was like 70s I want to say for sure I truly where is where is that America musical theater and I'm literally at a

36:54 point in my life where I just like I don't care this is why I don't feel bad when like people like Millennials will get on Tick Tock and be like gen Z doesn't know who's saying scrubs can you believe well it's no scrubs yeah whatever Twilight therap was also big in the 60s I don't know why I was thinking she was okay wow you're a great person real [ __ ] Molly how Jerry I'm really the most ignorant person on this podcast [Music] yeah no they don't have to know who who sang No Scrubs we'll all be dead um soon so oh my God

37:41 that's on the Google Doc so apparently the executive at Sony which who was the distributor or maybe was Columbia I don't know Colombia and also Sony merged at one point so um he basically like re-cut the film to make like a 30 minute shorter more audience friendly version of the film oh and Miss tamore did not have a girl yes she was pissed she threatened to sue blah blah blah blah they ended up releasing they tested out her version on like test audiences and it went well and then they did like a slow roll out of the film and it did fine like their problems were not like the editing per se so um so yeah you take out all the drug stuff

38:27 in the middle I that has to be what it is every single even the positive reviews are like that entire section needs to go yeah that's approximately 30 minutes at which RJ took that photo of me being like I would I like this movie but I would pay good American dollars for somebody to re-edit this without the drugs sorry Bono sorry drugs act genuinely sorry Eddie is hard because she's amazing but yeah yeah and Adam like clocked it right away she was just like oh that's Eddie that's Eddie I know I truly know Eddie's voice I can pick it out of anything anywhere yeah yeah I I have seen so many Eddie Izard

39:12 specials so many times yeah I know the voice um so anyway the theatrical cut ended up being her version and then she had them destroy every single version of the other cut like the books in Alexandria they had to agree they finally made a reference I got thank you I gotta go wait you gotta go way back yeah I remember when Molly was like I don't really like musicals like ending in like 1990s starting in like 3000 BCS um so yeah so she had them like promise I don't know I think he swear that they will never re-edit her oh my God except

39:58 for like television versions which they have to edit for time um yeah that's it um that's all I had this movie won uh no I'm sorry this movie was nominated for one Academy Award it was nominated for best costume design and this movie was nominated the Golden Globes for best Motion Picture musical or comedy but it did not win I understand I don't know production design yeah yeah there's there's like I feel like there should be more design categories than it would have I agree that was like the main thing that I was like oh this is okay Julie's this is this is the vision at work yeah the problem is is that I think I think there's a lot of cool things happening

40:45 if I was like to objectively look at it um the problem would be my guess is that a they couldn't decide what was cinematography and what was editing because there is so much post-production work happening on top of what's being filmed so it's like what do you draw as the line yes but I mean surely all movies of that problem yeah um this just has that to the nth degree yeah um and then the other thing I would guess would be oh I had it and then I lost it so I made it up I mean I'm making all this up so I don't know I don't know why I was nominated why asking me stop yelling at me I'm making all this up like you're like realizing that the way that human beings speak is that we don't pre-plan everything

41:32 my requests but um yeah I also oh I the other thing I was gonna say prop this movie does a great if this movie if you were like I want to watch a movie that seems like it's actually just a series of music videos that's about a feature-length film long this is the absolute film for you Visual Album of a re reconcept of black is King who I'll cross the universe did it first I I think that you are underselling the plot of the movie I'm not saying it's an extremely strong plot but there is a through line there are others hit the floor and now he has to get surgery to fix his jaw

42:17 it is so great I it was amazing last night I was like I'm so excited for this episode we're gonna record tomorrow because Molly absolutely is gonna be like me she's gonna go off we're gonna like commiserate together and I tweeted this I texted this photo of me absolutely pouting watching this film and Molly was like and then I said something about how I hated it and Molly was like oh I do not feel the same and I looked at my phone in in I was at Gog for like 10 minutes I was like I can't believe that my comrade in Arms This Benedict Arnold has gone behind my back there you go it's fine um whatever I I will get to the movie so we are finally back into an era in which I can tell you the weekend release uh box

43:06 office ratings isn't that exciting I love doing this because it's such a such a moment in time and since we were all in high school when this came out I was like what a trip we'll all remember all these films because we saw maybe five of them okay so starting with um the weekend went wide which was its fifth week in release uh this is the weekend of October 12th um Across the Universe comes in at eighth place this is the highest placement it got in its entire original run um eighth place great good job seventh place is a movie called The Kingdom by Universal Pictures I no I don't know do you know I feel like that was the movie that was like Matt Damon in like the Huns or

43:53 China like defeating you know defeating Huns or something like that that was yeah I feel like we were in college when that happened because I feel like college is when we invented being mad about cultural appropriation we're right yeah yeah um no one was doing it before us um six it was a Jamie Foxx movie about a federal agent who assembles a team to infiltrate and destroy a terrorist cell based in Saudi Arabia well that's very post-9 11 movie making I'll say that um number six it just reminded me of the toxic patriotism of the 2000s of of the Greece 2 episode we did at the end when we were like oh yeah American flags Trend alert

44:42 um number six is uh the sequel to The Elizabeth movie from the 90s this is Elizabeth the Golden Age starring Cate Blanchette I believe she ends up being nominated for the Academy Award for this role uh number five is the Heartbreak Kid by Dreamworks nope nope uh number four Michael Clayton we're getting we're getting George Clooney we're getting Tilda Swinton Tilda we're getting set a movie about a lawyer yes I feel like it's like a it's like a it feels like a Manchurian Candidate it's a legal thriller yeah a Pelican Brief yes a Pelican Brief yeah an albatross thong a Pelican Brief

45:33 how much okay number three is We Own the Night which I know from my brain is a title of a film couldn't tell you anything about it number two is the game plan by Walt Disney Studios nothing no it's not like a rom-com maybe maybe I feel like it's like a like a Sandy Bullock hold on let me look real quick because I have a feeling it's like the proposal I have a feeling it's gonna be like oh it's Dwayne The Rock Johnson as a football player with a ballerina daughter I think um okay that does make more sense at Walt Disney released it and then the number one film in the box office the

46:18 weekend of October 12 2007 was a little film from Lionsgate called Tyler Perry's Why Did I Get Married which did so well at the box office during its run it got a sequel the very next year Why Did I Get Married Too I remember renting this from Blockbuster I watched it with friends and I watched this at home and I was like this is hilarious I've never laughed harder to film period yeah period Molly's never seen it we all know that the straights are struggling but um I don't know why they need so many movies about the fact that they hate their marriages uh but I assume it's a great movie oh it's fine I mean it's it's a Tyler Perry movie so it's you know it's Chris Rock doing this thing

47:04 Chris Rock he's in it he's the main guy no oh am I thinking of I think I love my wife I'm thinking of it I think I yeah I think that's that one okay let's move on wait no pack tracking oh and I'm letting RJ spend more time to Clank his Fork around his plate no no this will not become an ASMR podcast I'll tell you that much information right now Tyler Perry seems to be the main guy and um Janet Jackson like Janet Jackson absolutely sorry I just saw that Why Did I Get Married Too actually came out 2010 three years later so I apologize finds out

47:52 finds out finds out let's move on foreign and we'll go right into the closer if we don't I enjoy this movie I don't know that I would have watched it again without this prompt to watch it again but I watched it on a Sunday night it was a great time what I didn't love as the opener as I

48:38 was being reintroduced to this movie from high school is that it starts with Jim Sturgis very pretty man enjoyed him being in this movie but he turns to the camera on the beach and it's it's pretty intense that he's looking at you he gets the camera gets pretty close and his song is something about like hey could I tell you about this girl that I knew and then we like see some some footage of Evan Rachel Wood um and I was like do you know what no I have seen Buffet no about white men wanting to tell me about some girl that they fell in love with that I was like there's not a less appealing way you could start a movie than having a white man turn to a camera and say could I tell you a story about a girl that I knew it's the least interesting thing to

49:24 hook me in the world honestly I do feel like I understand that this movie they're coming up with an entirely original concept yeah so this movie can be whatever it wants to be um clearly but I feel like maybe they were like well it should be told like a man has to be the protagonist because it's the Beatles and they're like four guys I don't know if that was the reasoning or if they were just like story is man and that was when we just started from there which I think was like Aristotle's first tenet of Storytelling yeah the first one has to send her around a man yeah um that's why Medea flopped speaking of Tyler Perry shut up I think because Julie taymor very famous woman director and you know

50:11 one of the writers on it right although not known for centering women in her stories specifically she did of course do Tempest with Helen Miram as Prospero so she's done some recasting into women but and Frieda she directed Frida which is obviously about uh amazing historical female figure I mean I think they probably that's a Golden Girls I was trying to think of a funny freedom because you didn't say who the famous Freedom was so I was like running through freedom Freedom um anyway I I think they probably were like let's do a love story that's a very

50:57 clear yeah um and I think they probably wanted the character that's from Liverpool um not that it's like really necessary there's not like a song that the Beatles saying where it's like here is a song about Liverpool where like you have to have some explanation for it but I think it's a fun connection ode sure node is that it oh I forgot I've just steered the podcast it's all you girls did Molly abode speaking of ships uh uh Jude our main character then we see our two eventual lovers who are in love

51:45 with other people Jude makes his way on a boat across to America and we have a little cute moment where he not really cute but like he thought that maybe his dad was a professor at Princeton because he knew that his dad worked there but then it turns out his dad is a janitor um and then he just kind of ends up hanging out with Max and I did want to bring up the scene because they sang I get buy With a Little Help from My Friends and Rita told me about how that they wanted that to be their senior song when she was like High School yeah and she wanted to be their senior song but they wouldn't let them make it the senior song because of the line I get high with a Little Help from My Friends and she she nurses the scrunch to this day that she thinks it's ridiculous Rita I think you have grounds for a lawsuit I

52:32 think so I think you should get uh the class back together yeah I think class action if anyone has the qualifications to lead that charge my mother who worked in litigation yeah it would be Rita Rita you're retired now you know some people Garden uh some people play golf some people have class action lawsuits for fun yeah all right well I I will ask this prompt as we talk about the introduction of all these characters um what do we what did we feel about the way the characters are introduced and who did you feel connected to and not connected to in the way that we learned about our cast of characters

53:18 I'll let RJ talk first I I as far as like how each character was introduced I did appreciate what was being done obviously they were kind of just like being thrusted to us with a song um and it that was kind of like the moment where I was like okay I'm not under this is yes there is a narrative like a linear narrative but like we're seeing like glimpses of just like this is just the turmoil fast and loose times of of the of this period very music heavy yes so I was like okay I'm just gonna like sit along for the ride and just like kind of accept what is shown to me I I think I was most it's hard because I think like uh I I would say Prudence probably had

54:05 the best like first impression but throughout the story goes nowhere throughout the story I was most affected and like connected with Max I think his I felt like his journey was the most compelling um and I really liked his portrayal and I liked that I think he played the character just very well and very true to like what that person would be going through at this time and then just like also really liked Evan Rachel Woods portray I just really liked seeing her uh and I just like seeing her act so but I think yeah like Prudence I think had the best like entrance I think because it was very clear like what this character's uh stakes and what their objective is and what just what they're what they are who they are

54:51 um but ended up kind of like following along with Max's Journey a lot more what about you Adam um I I I I I I I I I I have a problem okay I think how mostly how they're introduced is fine um I do have issues with how JoJo is introduced um that whole sequence is not great uh but um I think it's fine I this movie I think to me what I find the biggest flaw in this movie and there are a few but I think the biggest one is that it feels like when this is what it feels like do you know that I'm gonna do the

55:36 Ross Matthews do you know that thing so in senior year of college we did the 24-hour theater project and I wrote I was a playwright for it and it was the first year where we did it where there was like a challenge to the it was like a contest it's not it was stop being like we're just doing theater and like for some reason that year it was like and now there's points being awarded and I was like what the [ __ ] for what anyway I don't remember that there were points continue it was all Sarah Espinoza who came up with it by the way anyway gotcha um I directed Adam's uh play and I don't remember the points oh great you'll remember maybe that uh or you probably weren't there yet this is why you don't know so um playwrights were told that if we used

56:24 there was like a there was like a list of things that if we put into the play we would get like bonus points for doing oh okay this movie is the equivalent of me putting every single thing to get the bonus points into the into it when there's no reason to should we basically explain what a 24-hour theater Festival is for I had to write a play in 24 hours and then we did it the next day you you you have four hours from the first moment the player gets the prompt to the time that the play is presented so that time to write direct put it on the costume design yeah all that stuff so I and I put all of the challenges I was like I'm gonna get the points and it wasn't good because I focused too much on that and not just like doing my little plus amazing I don't know what

57:10 you're talking about it was bad it was a very bad scratch um and it's fine it's 24 hours who cares but this movie is the equivalent of that where they were like I have to fit as many Beatles songs into this film whether they work or they don't they have to be in here we've paid allegedly 10 million 10 million dollars so we have to just we have to get all this in we have to get the girlies in we got to get the people in the seats butts in seats we got to get them to see we have to remember the lineage of The Beatles it does I think you're right that it is overstuffed with music it seems like they should have changed the levers a little bit to do at least 15 more plot and scenes yeah music

57:57 yeah because you're so aware that they're working backwards yeah right they're taking the songs to make the plot fine I love Mamma Mia that's fine they're going backwards from it but then there's not given enough time between the songs for you to develop a relationship on screen with the characters so like pretty soon in we're supposed to believe that Jude and Lucy have I have chemistry and I not once in this movie do I think these people have chemistry I think they're good actors I think they are a fine looking couple so I can go along with that just for the sake of like aesthetic purposes I like to see two Attractive people smoosh to

58:42 get smush their faces together but I did not feel at any point in this movie where I was like there is a deep attraction and longing they have for each other that is like ephemeral I did not feel that hard disagree RJ you have to break the time so you are the Kamala Harris my Democrats if I wanted to make sure whatever you said that I had a chance I would say I think for the first time ever there's a tie and I think you're two twinners I I think that it I there there is chemistry I think I bought it more in some numbers than others so I win is what you're saying

59:29 ground it Crown it um I think that [Laughter] they appreciate that they have chemistry I think to me this movie works because I like their love story um I like them as a couple and so the the fact that that's the very simple through line of it is just will these two end up together works for me on just like a fundamental basis I find the bowling scene where they sing uh score tonight that was a Grease 2 reference our favorite episode Grease 2 is our new Christmas on the Square yeah it's definitely becomes a new Christmas on the Square so there is a bowling see I actually don't remember what the song is

1:00:15 at all this is where our lack of Beatles knowledge is going to fail us and that's 30. yeah it's a song about like I think it's a turtle's face or no it's not a famous one I would remember hello hello baby there's this there's the scene where they're in the the bowling alley and um he's singing about how he's met this girl and he's falling for her and stuff and the lights are all different and she keeps calling me back again and it's very like 60s folksy upbeat like cute cute love song and so to me that really liked that song sells it to me and I I'm really happy about them falling in love with each other I will say that it's a little weird because I

1:01:00 don't know what their ages are exactly but Jude because he has this very clear like working class background he's like worked his way through a shipyard to get on a ship to go to America he feels like he's much more of an adult than she is at that point because she is still in high school she's like independent enough that he's like worked for a paycheck and like traveled to a new country and stuff like that and she is very much like still just beginning to emerge now I think they do a really good job of having her mature over the course of the film and they get together at like an appropriate time where it's not like super creepy but it's like a little like oh I think we'd work a little harder in 2022 to like get these two to be introduced to each other on a little bit more of a a parody in terms of maturity level but I don't find it to be you know totally off-putting or anything yeah I almost wish that like

1:01:47 because technically that bowling scene is the her senior year Thanksgiving right so that's the first time you seeing her but it's really not until the summer after she's graduated where she's in New York that they actually fall in love that I almost wouldn't have minded if they just planted the seeds and then like did more of the falling in love like in New York um which I think was what they were trying to do with the song but like yeah because also what happens in between that is that her boyfriend her boyfriend listed in the war dies and so she has this traumatic thing again maybe not with the like women's trauma using it for a plot device whatever but but you do have she lives through this thing that you understand makes her much more

1:02:32 adult and I have to live in the sort of this this where bad things happen and it it becomes her core motivation to become this activist eventually in the movie um and that that's that's really like what is the most important thing about her character is that she is this this activist against the war um so I think that that works well and I think yeah I think I just like she's just like a stronger protagonist for me yeah so it's frustrating that Jude is like the main character of this film because like hmm he's like weirdly apolitical about a thing that like well I think that's an inch I so I the movie is asking this question about can these two be together because he is very apolitical and she's extremely politically active and I think that's interesting I think to me where it fails

1:03:19 is that it because it's so oversaturated with music it doesn't have enough chances to like have actual scenes to discuss that yeah tension and this question but I think we should put a pin in that concept because I I think the movie is trying to ask a real question with that fact I don't know that Jude though it's he he is our framing device which suggests that he's the main character but I totally agree like I watched the movie sort of through her like to me it's her story in a lot of ways and that that's the character that I feel connected with and that I am like following what's happening to her um so yeah I can get on board the idea that they should not have started the I already said why I didn't want them with Jude but I could also get more on board with the dramaturgical sense of maybe it should not be framed through Jude

1:04:06 but you brought up a point about um the grief she suffers because yes let's go back to that scene so her boyfriend dies I think his name is David or Daniel I think that's important it doesn't matter we don't exist to die ever again he exists um and it is exactly counter his funeral with the 1967 Riots of Detroit um famous I think they're referenced in Dream Girls so actual historical events um but uh that's how we know events are historical it's referencing movies and yeah yeah we only know about things in

1:04:51 the 60s because they're in Dream Girls so you wouldn't know about World War II if not for The Sound of Music in Cabaret and that's important yeah yeah absolutely um anyway so they're like countered as like to it feels very crashed to me the like 2005 movie Crash which is like about all these different people in their disparate lives but how they all connect through like trauma basically um it's not a good movie um but uh there's the riots in Detroit and then a young man dies this is during let it be the one of the most famous John Lennon songs ever probably um and I didn't love I didn't love like framing it to be like

1:05:37 her going through her boyfriend dying in war horrible and also we're not gonna pay trauma We're not gonna play trauma Olympics it just felt weird to parallel something that's racially it was a strange it was a strange comparison of the two things yeah and let me just recount as neutrally as possible for the listeners the series of shots that happens so Evan Rachel Wood's character she's like riding her bike down the street and then she sees the Army going to the house of her boyfriend and sees her mother his mother gets a telegram and then she's like crying on the porch so we understand oh my gosh her boyfriend died in the war smash cut to this boy who's maybe 13. would you say sure singing Let It Be

1:06:23 Well hiding behind a cop car in Detroit we see all this image that tells us it's the Detroit Riots and then we cut back to Evan Rachel Wood at her boyfriend's funeral they're like folding up the flag all those signifiers and then we cut back to Detroit and that boy is dead he is in a coffin and they are watching they're we're watching the the viewing of the body and people walking past and one of those people is Jojo and that is how we meet Jojo I haven't had any scenes I didn't even I didn't even clock him as a character because he's he is he is introduced the way Liza Minnelli's character is introduced in the Cabaret where it's just like and her yeah you think he's just gonna be another mourner and in fact because it'd been a long time since

1:07:08 I watched this I was like holy crap no no like I had forgotten that JoJo was a character and I was like why is this scene into she just felt like she had to include the the riots civil rights movement and so then and then we end the sequence on JoJo's face yes at the funeral and you kind of have this moment of like oh this is this must be like kind of an important character it's not really until the next scene he's in where he's like at a train station going to New York that you're like oh we'll continue to follow this guy um but it is like the use of this little black boy is very like I mean I made a joke that her boyfriend exists just to die but like this is in an extreme circumstance of like let's use this black child's body to be a

1:07:54 metaphor for trauma and it feels upsetting in a uh yes uh because I always want to say post-block lives matter but I don't I'll be sort of after it we're in there's a post-racial America you can say it Molly yeah this is 2007 we hadn't elected Barack Obama yet as president so yeah yes we had yeah but then we did fix it yeah we didn't fix racism yet yeah is a joke alert alert this is a joke America is [ __ ] alert alert um I just think that you would handle this as a lot more sensitivity to like

1:08:41 this is a real thing that still happens now versus at the time it felt it feels like it was very sort of uh remember that like we can just flash up some images and that'll just remind everybody of this thing that happened in the past yeah that was just the the most egregious part was that like because because we didn't realize that it was an introduction to a new character for me I was like we're just like using this like very traumatic experience of black pain to score and like contextualize Lucy's grief that I was like oh this is bad it feels very bad um and it's also even weird once you

1:09:26 learn who JoJo is and follow his whole story that his story is also not about the civil rights movement and no and didn't connect that he fled just before he mentions this but like who is that boy I don't know is it for the Sun or the Wikipedia page it's his younger brother but like there is no I've missed a few things in this movie because I was like pouting or textual evidence that they are related yeah to be clear yeah to be clear he's not sitting at the front of the church at the funeral he like it's it's not clear so I just want to point that out because I I didn't even know I didn't even like kind of piece together that they were focusing on him at the funeral like he

1:10:12 he was just like a number of images they cut to a gospel choir um um I'm so sorry for coughing um and other shots and so I just didn't even I mean like the whole time I was like what's going on and then it wasn't until I think like after he had already been introduced later when he like gets to New York that I like kind of was like wait was he at the funeral and that's just how we met I I was I was lost I was lost yeah to be honest um let's we feel like we've covered how bizarre this again I like this movie I feel like it's gonna be like a greatest showman situation where I'm gonna say a lot of critical things but I did like the

1:10:58 overall experience um since we're talking so about character introductions if we feel like we've covered Jojo and why we disagree with how exactly that was brought in should we go back to I Want to Hold Your Hand That RJ mentioned earlier prudence's introduction yeah sure let's listen to a little bit of it first [Music] and please say to me you'll let me hold your hands [Music]

1:11:55 out this is the best song in the whole movie ah no I have a different one I think song music song number best like a song that already existed now I'm not saying I want to hold up I'm saying the best pairing of that song to visuals a plot like put putting it into a movie I feel that this is the best one yeah I think it's good I I personally letterbox would agree with you Molly let her tell you oh I'm sure letter I'm sure

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